Okay- Time once again to..
Bring out the gun nuts.
Don't let the NRA block sensible gun-control laws.
Other forms of gun control could get you killed.(By your wife)
(Below is a tedious list of statistics (which NRA “extremies” and other wingies refuse to acknowledge) only for those inclined to delve and research. Of course, this information has always been available-but who has time to sort out facts these days...?)
Weapons Possessed by the Branch Davidians
In total, the Texas Department of Public Safety, led by the Texas
Rangers, recovered more than 300 firearms from the Branch
Davidian compound. In addition, a number of live grenades and
more than 300 grenade components were uncovered. Hundreds of
thousands of rounds of ammunition were also seized.
The Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms investigated David
Koresh for conduct involving: the illegal manufacture of machine
guns and the illegal manufacture and possession of destructive
devices. The FBI report provides evidence that the Davidians'
arsenal did indeed include weapons unlawfully manufactured. The
weapons listed include semiautomatic firearms illegally modified
to fire in full automatic mode, as well as grenades and
silencers. All of these weapons were unlawfully possessed.
I hope you find these documents useful as you review Treasury's
report on ATF's role in events at Waco.
WEAPONS RECOVERED FROM THE BRANCH DAVIDIAN COMPOUND:
TREASURY SUMMARY OF REPORT PREPARED BY THE FBI FOR PROSECUTORS
AND THE TEXAS DEPARTMENT OF PUBLIC SAFETY
ILLEGAL WEAPONS RECOVERED
Machine guns
The FBI determined that 46 semiautomatic firearms had been
modified to fire in full automatic mode:
22 M-16 Type Rifles
20 AK-47 Type Rifles
2 Heckler and Koch SP-89
2 M-11/Nine
The FBI also determined that two AR-15 lower receivers had been
modified to fire in full automatic mode.
Silencers
21 Sound suppressors or silencers
Hand Grenades
4 Live M-21 Practice Hand Grenades
The possession of lawfully manufactured machineguns, silencers,
or grenades requires the owner to register the weapon with the
Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco & Firearms. None of the compound's
residents were registered to own such a weapon, therefore it
would have been illegal for them to possess these weapons.
WEAPONS RECOVERED FROM THE BRANCH DAVIDIAN COMPOUND:
TREASURY SUMMARY OF REPORT PREPARED BY THE FBI FOR PROSECUTORS
AND THE TEXAS DEPARTMENT OF PUBLIC SAFETY
TOTAL WEAPONS RECOVERED
(Including Weapons Mentioned on Previous Page)
FIREARMS
Rifles and Rifle Components
61 M-16 Type and 2 M-16 Lower Receivers
61 AK-47 Type
34 AR-15 Type and 2 AR-15 Lower Receivers
13 Shotguns -- 12 gauge
11 7.62MM FN FAL Type
10 Mini-14 Type
7 37mm. Flare Gun/Launcher Type
6 .30 Carbine Calber US Carbine, Model M1
6 Assorted Rifles
5 M-11/Nine
5 M-14 Type
3 Galil
2 Heckler and Koch SP-89
1 Air Rifle
1 Heckler and Koch MP-5
1 Sten submachine gun
Pistols and Revolvers
23 Beretta
13 Glock
8 Assorted Revolvers
6 Safari Arms
6 Assorted Pistols
5 Sig Sauer
5 Walther
2 Taurus
EXPLOSIVES
Hand Grenades
4 Live M-21 Practice Hand Grenades
100+ Modified M-21 Practice Hand Grenade bodies; the bodies
of these had been threaded and plugged but lacked a main charge
or fusing system.
11 M-69 Practice Hand Grenades; the bodies of these
grenades exhibited indications of attempted modifications.
219 Grenade Safety Pins
243 Grenade Safety Levers
Rifle Grenades
200+ Inert M31 Practice Rifle Grenades.
FIREARMS ACCESSORIES AND PARTS
Silencers
21 Sound suppressors or silencers.
Flash Suppressors
18 Flash Suppressors.
Firearms Barrels
17 M-16/AR-15 Type (5.56mm)
8 M-16/AR-15 Type (9mm caliber)
3 M-16/AR-15 Type (.45 ACP caliber)
1 M-16/AR-15 Type (5.56mm)
2 Ruger. 22 Caliber
1 M-60 machine gun
1 12 Gauge Shotgun
1 Taurus, Model 92, 9mm pistol barrel
1 Sig Sauer 9mm pistol barrel
Pistol Slides
1 Sig Sauer Model
Revolver Parts
1 .38 Special caliber cylinder
Bolt Carriers
39 M-16
24 AR-15
2 MP-5
2 AK-47
1 FAL
1 Unknown
Bolts
15 AK-47
7 .22 LR conversion
3 M-16/AR-15
1 FN FAL (1)
Bolt Assemblies
3 M-11/Nine
2 M-16
1 AR-15
1 MAC-10
1 Shotgun
Recoil Springs and Guides
3 Glock
2 Sig Sauer
1 Beretta
1 M-11/Nine
Stripper Clips
29 Stripper Clips
Accessories
6 .22 LR Caliber Conversion Kits
Hammers
31 AK-47
18 M-16
12 AR-15
4 M-11/Nine
2 Sig Sauer
1 Beretta
Hammer Springs
3 AK-47
Buffer/Recoil Springs
36 M-16/AR-15
4 AK-47
Selector Switches
9 M-16
3 AR-15
1 Unknown
Sears
1 M-11/Nine
Auto Sears
8 AK-47
4 M-16
1 FN FAL
Auto Sear Springs
12 AK-47
Disconnects
7 AK-47
1 M-16
Trigger/Trigger Mechanisms/Trigger Housings
17 M-16
6 AR-15
3 M-60
3 M-11/Nine
2 MP-5
2 Sten
1 AK-47
1 Heckler & Koch
1 M-14
1 Smith & Wesson
1 Beretta
1 Shotgun
Ammunition Magazines
289 7.62 x 39mm AK-47 Type
248 .223/5.56mm M-16/AR-15 Type
108 Sten Gun Type
88 .308 Caliber FN FAL Type
72 M-14 Type
61 Beretta Model Type 92
58 .308 Caliber of Unknown Type
28 Ruger Mini-14 Type
22 .22 Caliber
17 UZI Type
16 USAS-12 Type
13 .45 Caliber
11 Glock
11 MP-5
11 Sig Sauer P226/P228
9 Unknown Type
7 .308 Caliber Galil Type
6 Walther PPK
5 9mm Unknown Type
4 .50 Caliber
3 .30 Caliber U.S. Carbine
3 .380 Auto Caliber
2 9mm Smith & Wesson
1 AK-74 Type
1 Grendel
Ammunition Containers
220 Metal Boxes (Various Calibers)
15 Wooden Boxes (Various Calibers)
4 Buckets (Varioius Calibers)
1 Cardboard Boxes (Various Calibers)
Magazine Springs
360 M-16/AR-15
42 FN FAL .308 Caliber Type
35 AK-47
28 9mm Magazine Springs of Unknown Type
15 Unknown
10 M-14
6 M-1 Carbine
3 .50 Caliber
1 Mini-14 Magazine
1 Glock
These lists do not include dozens of other items recovered from
the Compound such as dust covers, extractors, front and rear
sights, gun cleaning equipment, bolt release levers,
compensators, .50 caliber belt links and numerous other parts.
Comments
Hell no there is not one thread of truth in the whole article! This article is a gun grabbers wet dream! So If I want to sell a legal firearm to my neighbor a State Trooper I have to get a permit from the Government? It is Illegal and has been Illegal since 1933 to possess an automatic firearm without a Federal Permit and Stamp. Since this law was put into place not ONE legally owned Fully Automatic Firearm (machine gun) has been used in a crime. For the last 20 or so years I go to at least one Gun Show a month and have NEVER seen a Class III firearm for sale by other than a Federal Licensed Dealer. Furthermore:
"private gun dealers"
What is a "private gun dealer"?
" Al Qaeda members in the United States could "obtain an assault weapon legally, preferably AK-47 "
Federal Law makes it Illegal to possess an AK-47 in all 50 States and territories! Possession of one without the proper paper work is illegal both Federally and in most States!!
"The Pakistani store owner said he had bought handguns, rifles, and a submachine gun at gun shows since 1994."
Bullshit, that excuse is as old as "not me officer I was in the back seat singing". Like he's going to give up the Jihadist network that smuggled it in with Drugs and Illegal Aliens with the help of the Mexican Army....Right!!
"Mohamed had purchased an arsenal weapons from Michigan gun shows without undergoing background checks."
Same Shit Different State, oh and what was in this alleged "arsenal"?
" Koresh had at least 200 automatic and semi-automatic assault rifles stockpiled, plus thousands of rounds of ammunition."
After the fire State and Federal Authorities sifted through the ruins of the Branch Dividian Complex and from the Serial numbers found on the firearms in the ashes determened that not ONE was an ILLEGAL AUTOMATIC WEAPON!!
"Harris and Dylan Klebold procured two shotguns, an assault rifle, and a TEC-9 "
BULLSHIT, Harris and Klebold did not Posess an ASSAULT RIFLE. The had a 9mm Semi-auto rifle which by the way is manufactured here in Mansfield, OH.
Posted by: danny | August 19, 2008 9:43 AM
Not that it would do any good, but Danny should read this article:
http://tinyurl.com/5plrgo
Posted by: Forest Guntrol | August 19, 2008 9:46 AM
Your buddy Danny needs to get his head out of….. the sand. Here goes:
Private sellers are individuals who "legally" sell guns out of their homes, backpacks, car trunks and at thousands of annual Gun Shows in the 32 US States. Private gun sellers/individuals can sell an unlimited number of guns to other private individuals without requiring a criminal background check or even see an ID. This private gun seller loophole is allowed by Federal law and criminals and terrorist have exploited it for years. Timothy McVeigh, the Okla Bomber was a "private gun seller". In other words, you and I as law abiding gun owners buy our guns at gun stores/Federally Licensed Gun Dealers who are required to run background checks and felons and terrorists who know they're prohibited simply go to private gun sellers/dealers and buy "cash and carry"- no questions asked.
In particular Gun Shows are the equivalent of terrorists walking directly on to the airplane while you and I wait in the TSA line!
Assault Weapons
There is no Federal law that prohibits the sale and ownership of AK 47's. Bush and Congress allowed the so-called Federal Assault Weapon Ban (that included AK 47's and 18 other military style weapons) to expire in 2004. A few states like MA have renewed the Ban but most haven't.
Incidentally urban and industrialized MA has the most comprehensive gun violence prevention laws and second lowest firearm fatality rate per 100,000 population (second only to rural Hawaii) in the Nation. MA is connected to ME, NH and VT, that allow private gun sales without background checks and as you well know Hawaii is pretty isolated. I guess gun laws really do work!
The jihad training manual I referred to was located on an Internet jihad web site and was reportedly found in terrorist safe houses in Kabul, Afghanistan by US Special Forces just after September 11, 2001.
Columbine High School Shooting
Robyn Anderson made a straw purchase of a Hi-Point 995 Carbine 9 mm semi-automatic rifle, a 12 gauge Savage-Springfield 67H pump-action shotgun (Serial No. A232432) and a 12 gauge Stevens 311D double barreled shotgun (Serial No. A077513) at a Tanner gun show near Denver. These weapons were later used in the Columbine High School massacre on April 20, 1999.[1] On June 4, 1999, Anderson admitted buying the two shotguns and the 9mm carbine rifle from a Denver gun show.
Waco
Executing a search warrant, 4 FBI agents and 6 Davidians died in an exchange of gunfire. 76 people perished in the fire which destroyed the compound after a 51 day siege. I'll forward under separate cover a list of weapons the BATF recovered at the Branch Davidian compound after the fire. Koresh used a US made 50 caliber Barrett Sniper Rifle (look up Barrett in Tenn-range of up to 2 miles and designed to penetrate steel) to blow up an FBI armored vehicle. Your buddy can buy one from a private gun seller at a gun show in 32 states without a background check. Osama bin Laden bought a dozen when he was on our side fighting the Soviets in Afghanistan.
Danny has no idea what he's talking about when it comes to Federal gun policy.
Posted by: John Rosenthal | August 19, 2008 9:55 AM
I don't comment but read this blog frequently, and I notice that this Danny dude's only recourse is to insult the people who provide facts which tear down his specious arguments. So I guess I am glad there is a 2 comment limit. I'm okay with just this one. thank you over and out.
Posted by: KaneyM | August 19, 2008 10:00 AM
Here is the background info concerning guns that were discovered at the various events cited in my Op Ed. You have already attached the extensive list of weapons recovered from Waco.
This Op Ed
http://tinyurl.com/3xfgpw
was published in the Christian Science Monitor.
Also check out the Cahn 5/ABC news affiliate gun show story: Chan 5 went undercover with hidden cameras and microphones at a Vermont gun show and Federally Licensed gun dealers and others are on camera KNOWINGLY OFFERING TO BREAK LAWS in order to sell guns to prohibited buyers.
To access the Channel 5 news story:
Go to youtube.com
Search “Stop Handgun Violence” (note: remember to include quotes)
The first story is Stop Handgun Violence – Channel 5 news
Posted by: John Rosenthal | August 19, 2008 10:09 AM
my head hurts alredy.
Posted by: Duane Ingalls Glasscock | August 19, 2008 10:39 AM
Well Cccchhhhhuuuuuuucccccckkkkkk!It looks like you really shook the tree today!You know I read and contribute to this marvelous blog.I'm not as adament(sp.) as Danny but I believe in part what he says.I've seen this bumper sticker and believe it."If owning a gun is criminal only criminals would have guns"or close enough.But it seems that SOME of us have way to much free time?I also agree with D.I.G.!
Posted by: Bill Conway | August 20, 2008 2:45 AM